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  • #3115

    William
    Member

    If the three firefighters in the famous World Trade Center picture, raising the American flag, had been black and their race was changed for any reason,h ow do you think African Americans would have reacted? Tell the truth.

    User Detail :  

    Name : William, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Methodist, Age : 39, City : Columbia, State : SC Country : United States, Occupation : Sales, Education level : 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 
    #16395

    William24305
    Participant

    A.C.C The question was, what do you think the response would have been,had a photo of three black men been altered to represent other races.It was not a question of whether or not the picture would have been changed if the three fire men were black. An attempt was made to alter the picture of three men who are known by name and fire company. As to why it was only white men raising the flag, it was a spontaneous moment,not some photo opp.

    User Detail :  

    Name : William24305, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Methodist, Age : 38, City : Columbia, State : SC Country : United States, Occupation : Sales, Education level : 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 
    #17209

    katfish
    Participant

    Why can’t the three guys who actually raised it, who just happened to be white, be memorialized truthfully? What’s so damned evil about being white? I feel like I’m being erased in the rush to be PC. Is it politically incorrect to just be white? Is that a crime? “Living while being white”?

    User Detail :  

    Name : katfish, City : Montevallo, State : AL Country : United States, 
    #17424

    SG28422
    Participant

    The construction of this memorial is an inappropriate time to bring up the homogenous make-up of the NYC fire department. The statue should be a reflection of reality. The 3 men are Americans–that’s who they symbolize; the fact that they were all what is, I guess, unfortunately politically incorrect.

    User Detail :  

    Name : SG28422, Age : 24, City : Wichita, State : KS Country : United States, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 
    #41636

    ACC25067
    Participant

    If all three firefighters had been black, I very much doubt anyone would have wanted to change it, outside of some hardcore white racists. Remember the flag-raising at Iwo Jima during World War II? When the American public found out one of them was a Pima Indian named Ira Hayes, most whites were fascinated and took this as a hopeful sign of America’s inclusion of native people. Hayes was treated like a hero and widely welcomed in speaking tours all across the United States that raised funds for war bonds. If the firefighters had been black, I have no doubt they would have similarly been asked to speak all over the country and help raise funds for worthy causes by both black organizations and those aiding disaster relief. There might have been a few people grumbling, ‘Yeah, it’s only cuz they’re black, how typical,’ but they would have been in the minority.

    What I think has been missing from the discussion is: Why were there only white firefighters raising the flag? New York is not exactly short of non-whites, but apparently their Fire Department is virtually whites-only. It seems like people complaining about the change are mostly whites who are resentful or fearful of non-whites. It also seems to me that some people found the image more heroic precisely because the firefighters were white.

    User Detail :  

    Name : ACC25067, Gender : M, Race : Mexican and American Indian, City : Phoenix, State : AZ Country : United States, 
    #14490

    joseph29118
    Participant

    I do not necessarily think that the White firefighters were being slighted for political correctness. Another way of looking at the statue is that it is not about the individuals that performed the action of raising the flag. Rather, it is about the duty performed in the wake of a national tragedy that affected pretty much everyone in the country. The statue does not necessarily have to be about specifc firefighters, but about the ‘role’ firefighters took in the tragedy. If we see it that way, race becomes secondary.

    User Detail :  

    Name : joseph29118, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : Black/African American, Religion : Baptist, Age : 31, City : Lansing, State : MI Country : United States, Occupation : grad student instructor, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Lower middle class, 
    #42792

    Jay31344
    Participant

    Had the firefighters been black and a statue erected depicting white firefighters, African Americans would have been outraged and a campaign to change it back to the orignal would have resulted. Changing the race of the fire fighters was just stupid beyond belief, and really tainted the efforts of those who work relentlessly to bring attention to real discrimination of African Americans. As a female, I would have been embarassed if a female had replaced one of the male fire fighters. Inclusion and equal opportunity is a good thing, but this is not the way.

    User Detail :  

    Name : Jay31344, Gender : F, Race : White/Caucasian, City : New York, State : NY Country : United States, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 
    #36897

    Rick29842
    Participant

    You’re making some unfounded assumptions. NPR had a news story about the efforts of NYC-area fire departments’ efforts to attract more non-whites as firefighters. It’s not always discrimination that accounts for some professions being mostly white. I work in a profession that fails to attract very many non-whites, even though any blacks or Latinos are quickly moved up into management positions, regardless of their competence.

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    Name : Rick29842, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Atheist, City : Springfield, State : OH Country : United States, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 
    #24904

    katfish26624
    Participant

    I object to it getting changed because it isn’t true. We are editing history to make it more palatable to a broader audience. If it had been one black man, one hispanic, and one white guy, and the powers that be wanted to make it an all white statue, then I’d still cry foul that they were editing the truth. Am I not smart enough to construe that many people of many colors died that day? You know they died, I know they died- so why change it? The relative whiteness- or nonwhiteness of the rank and file in the NY Fire Dept. is not something I can speak to- other than knowing it’s often a role passed down through families, and maybe the blacks and hispanics haven’t ‘arrived’- and if they truly haven’t – then why pretend that they have?

    User Detail :  

    Name : katfish26624, Gender : F, Race : White/Caucasian, Age : 31, City : Montevallo, State : AL Country : United States, Occupation : Software, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Upper middle class, 
    #34292

    Rob
    Member

    If you had asked me before this question to tell you the races of all three, I probably would have been wrong on at least one of ’em. To me, the men were firefighters and I don’t think it matters what their race is. …but to answer your question… I think anyone would (SHOULD) be upset if an HONEST representation of actual events is altered because anyone thinks it’s not PC. If we are propagandize true life, does that mean we get to say that any historical atrocities didn’t happen just because they were socially, economically, genderly, racially, politically, or nationally biased at the time?

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    Name : Rob, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Age : 29, City : Royal Oak, State : MI Country : United States, Occupation : Architect, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 
    #35618

    IF the proposed statue was meant as a tribute to the three firefighters in the photo, of course it should be true to the photograph, BUT IT IS NOT a tribute to those three men. It is a tribute to firefighters in NYC and everywhere in America who risk their lives for others. The photo makes an excellent SYMBOL for replication, but it is incomplete in representing the diverse body of firefighters who risk life and limb in the line of duty — why is it such a big deal to make the statue CLOSER to that diversity than the photo depicts?

    User Detail :  

    Name : Kathleen Cross, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : African American/White, Religion : Bahai Faith, Age : 39, City : Los Angeles, State : CA Country : United States, Occupation : Technical writer/Author, Education level : 2 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 
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